335 Navigating Existential Crises with ND Teens

[00:00:01] Matthew Fishleder: It’s uncomfortable not to know what we’re here for. It’s uncomfortable to think about being mortal—about life being limited and temporary. These are scary things. Sometimes the best we can do is to validate what our kids are going through. Because it is uncomfortable stuff.
[00:00:30] Penny Williams: Welcome to Beautifully Complex, where we unpack what it really means to parent neurodivergent kids with dignity and clarity. I’m Penny Williams, and I know firsthand how tough and transformative this journey can be. Let’s dive in and discover how to raise regulated, resilient, beautifully complex kids together.
Welcome back, everybody. I’m excited today to have therapist Matthew Fishleder with me. We’re talking about something I experienced with my own kid years ago—something a lot of neurodivergent kids face at some point—and it can feel heavy and dark for parents. We’re diving into how to navigate existential crises in our teens and young adults.
Matthew, will you start by sharing a bit about who you are and what you do?
[00:01:45] Matthew Fishleder: Sure. I’m a psychotherapist and licensed marriage and family therapist. I’m also a neurodivergent person and a parent myself. I practice in Maryland and California, and I often work with adults and parents navigating anxiety, identity, and those deeper human questions.
[00:02:11] Penny Williams: So, let’s define what we mean by “existential crisis.” I think that term can sound really intense, but it’s part of the human experience.
[00:03:19] Matthew Fishleder: Yes. The word “crisis” often sounds catastrophic, but in psychological or existential terms, it’s more like a turning point. It’s when someone reaches a developmental pressure point—a moment of growth. It’s not necessarily a sign that something’s wrong.
An existential crisis can mean a young person is waking up to life’s deeper questions: What’s the point? Who am I? How long will I be here? What happens after I die? These are developmental questions, not symptoms of disorder.
[00:04:30] Penny Williams: Would that also include questions about purpose?
[00:04:37] Matthew Fishleder: Absolutely. Who am I? What do I want from life? What gives me meaning?
[00:04:45] Penny Williams: Are there signs parents might notice before things get really hard?
[00:05:04] Matthew Fishleder: It varies, but you might hear questions like “Why am I going to college?” or “What’s the point of all this?” Sometimes kids withdraw socially, struggle with motivation, or seem detached. It’s not always a sign they’ve lost direction—often, their brain is just reevaluating everything.
[00:05:51] Penny Williams: So those questions are signals for us to open conversations, if they’re open to it.
[00:05:57] Matthew Fishleder: Yes. Ask if they want to talk with you, or maybe with a counselor or trusted adult. Existential questions are big realities to process. For neurodivergent kids especially, executive function challenges can make it harder to organize those thoughts, which adds to the disorientation.
[00:07:07] Penny Williams: I hadn’t thought about that—the executive functioning piece. That makes so much sense.
[00:07:27] Matthew Fishleder: Exactly. It can be hard to follow a single line of thought when your brain is constantly shifting focus.
[00:07:41] Penny Williams: And what about giftedness? I’ve read that gifted kids are more likely to think deeply about meaning.
[00:07:41] Matthew Fishleder: Yes, often they are. They can hyperfocus on these questions and dive deeply into philosophy or existential writing. Depending on what they find, they might lean toward hope and meaning—or toward cynicism and hopelessness. That’s where support and perspective matter.
[00:08:38] Penny Williams: With so much access to information online, they can easily find both extremes.
[00:09:18] Matthew Fishleder: Exactly. Existential questioning can actually be healthy growth. It’s uncomfortable, yes—but that discomfort is part of human development. For parents, understanding the discomfort itself is key.
If my kid asks, “How do I live a meaningful life?” and I’m in the middle of juggling generations—caring for my parents and my kids—I might be asking the same thing. Recognizing that can help us connect and empathize.
[00:10:07] Penny Williams: Yeah. It’s uncomfortable for us too.
[00:10:07] Matthew Fishleder: Exactly. It helps to say so. To tell our kids, “It is uncomfortable not to know.” When we share that truth, it validates their experience without overwhelming them.
[00:11:08] Penny Williams: I feel that in my body as we talk about it. That uncertainty can trigger anxiety, especially for neurodivergent kids who crave predictability.
[00:12:17] Matthew Fishleder: Right. Uncertainty is hardwired to feel unsafe—we’re wired to seek answers. That’s what your teen is doing: trying to make sense of the unknown.
But when there isn’t an answer, validation matters most. My son, when he was four, used to ask, “Why is this like that?” and I’d say, “I don’t know.” Then he’d say, “I don’t know either.” And I’d tell him, “We don’t know together.”
[00:13:41] Penny Williams: I love that—“not knowing together.”
[00:13:50] Matthew Fishleder: Yeah. It doesn’t erase the fear, but it makes it more tolerable. Knowing you’re not alone in uncertainty can feel like relief.
[00:15:06] Penny Williams: And hearing an adult say “I don’t know” can actually help kids feel safer—like maybe it’s okay that they don’t have the answers yet.
[00:15:06] Matthew Fishleder: Exactly. A big part of therapy is helping people learn to be in that not knowing together. It’s powerful—for kids, for adults, for everyone.
[00:17:08] Penny Williams: Neurodivergent kids also tend to feel things more deeply. They might notice more, sense more, question more—and that intensity adds weight to everything.
[00:17:08] Matthew Fishleder: Yes. That sensitivity can amplify the sense of groundlessness—like, “If there’s no firm answer, where do I stand?”
[00:17:36] Penny Williams: You’ve written about the shared existential journey between parents and kids. I wish I’d known that years ago.
[00:18:06] Matthew Fishleder: It’s about accompaniment rather than fixing. When we stop trying to give answers and instead sit beside them in the questioning, connection grows—for both of us.
[00:18:47] Penny Williams: That connection can help relieve some of the loneliness that comes with big questions.
[00:19:22] Matthew Fishleder: Exactly. Notice your own discomfort before responding. When we regulate ourselves, we can connect more deeply.
I once joked that it would be nice if Ed McMahon showed up with a giant check and said, “Here’s your purpose!” But life doesn’t work like that. Sometimes, we have to listen to our own inner “Ed McMahon”—that small, quiet voice that points toward the next right thing.
[00:21:07] Penny Williams: I love that image. And I wonder—does bringing the body into it help? Grounding, breathing, those sorts of practices?
[00:21:37] Matthew Fishleder: Definitely. Awareness of what’s happening in our bodies—tightness, heart rate, tension—creates space for choice. Taking a few deep breaths or just noticing your feet on the floor can interrupt the stress loop between brain and body.
[00:23:04] Penny Williams: That simple?
[00:23:05] Matthew Fishleder: Sometimes, yes. My coworker used to ask me, “Are your feet on the floor?” It was such a grounding question. When we’re regulated, we respond from the thinking brain instead of the reactive brain.
[00:23:44] Penny Williams: That’s such a great reminder.
[00:23:49] Matthew Fishleder: It’s small but powerful. Regulation allows us to stay present with our kids’ big questions instead of getting swept up in our own fear.
[00:24:27] Penny Williams: And connection helps, too. Just a few minutes of shared time—especially around something they love—can regulate the nervous system.
[00:24:52] Matthew Fishleder: Exactly. Existential questions aren’t something to solve; they’re invitations to connect. When we regulate our own anxiety, we help our kids approach uncertainty from a place of safety.
[00:25:34] Penny Williams: Which is tough because we’re wired to avoid discomfort. But with awareness, we can learn to pause and breathe instead.
[00:25:59] Matthew Fishleder: And remember, we don’t need the perfect answer—we just need to be there.
[00:26:07] Penny Williams: So good. Where can folks find you, Matthew?
[00:26:07] Matthew Fishleder: You can find me at growingpresent.com. I welcome questions or contact from anyone who resonated with what we talked about.
[00:26:18] Penny Williams: I’ll link that up in the show notes. Thank you for being here and sharing this conversation—it’s such important work.
[00:26:44] Matthew Fishleder: Thank you for having me, Penny. It’s been a pleasure.
[00:26:46] Penny Williams: Take good care, everyone. I see you. You’re doing hard and meaningful work, and you don’t have to do it alone.