Intro 0:02

I think a big piece of helping parents find joy and raising kids with ADHD is making that mindset shift that it's not caused by bad parenting that these kids really are desperate to do. Well, these kids are good. They have good hearts, they don't want to be naughty. They don't want to be getting in trouble at school. A huge piece of it is just helping parents kind of undo years of criticism and feedback that they've been getting to help them see their child in a different light.

Penny Williams 0:32

Welcome to the parenting ADHD Podcast, where I share insights and strategies on raising kids with ADHD straight from the trenches. I'm your host, Penny Williams. I'm a parenting coach, author, ADHD a Holic and mindset Mama, honored to guide you on the journey of raising your a typical kid. Let's get started.

Welcome back to the parenting ADHD Podcast. I am really excited to have the three ladies of the parenting collective here with us on the podcast today is going to be an exciting conversation, a nice group conversation, which I love because we get so many different perspectives and insights. And we're just going to talk about finding joy and when you're raising kids with challenges, especially kids with ADHD, thanks for being here. Ladies. I am so excited that we're going to do this Finally, why don't you start by introducing the childhood collective? Okay, I just realized that I did not say it right both times.

The Childhood Collective 1:38

No, it's totally fine. Yeah, we're No, it's okay. We Yeah, we're the childhood collective. And you know, we started our business a couple of years ago, because we really saw a need. And we do a lot of evaluations in our practices. And we saw a need to really support parents in their journey of raising their neurodiverse kids, their kids with autism and ADHD. following those diagnoses, a lot of parents just felt really overwhelmed and unprepared. And we really wanted to just be there with them to support them through that journey. And we do that through providing tools and tips and resources. We have tons of free resources on our website, and we have an online course for parenting ADHD, again, we just really our heart is in helping to support families and raise independent and confident and happy kids with ADHD. Mm hmm.

Penny Williams 2:34

Yeah. Do you each want to tell us a little bit about what you do what your background is, before we jump in? Yeah, so

The Childhood Collective 2:40

I can go ahead. I'm Laurie long. And I am a child psychologist. And I have a private practice in Scottsdale where I specialize in testing for children with ADHD autism anxiety. And yeah, that's kind of my background. Mallory. How about you?

Yeah. So my name is Mallory. And I am also a child psychologist by training. But a stay at home mom right now. prior to having my son's I worked in the schools. I worked in pediatricians offices, I worked in private practice, all serving the same population that Laurie mentioned, working with families that are raising kids with ADHD, or autism or anxiety or other challenging behaviors. And

I'm Katie Syverson, I'm a speech language pathologist. And I also am in private practice. So I do evaluations and treatment. And over the years within speech, you just kind of do whatever, whoever walks in the door. But over time, it was like, I just found myself really drawn to kids with ADHD, executive functioning issues. And a lot of times that can also impact social skills and how you interact with peers. And so I got really into social groups and kind of just supporting kids in the community and realized that, gosh, there's a huge need for parrot training. And for the parents to be connected, they can't just drop their child off at speech. And so I would like bring them in my room, which was really scary. When I was starting out, I didn't have my own kids. But over time, it's definitely just become a huge passion. So that's how we all kind of got connected. And we all have just a really similar mission.

Penny Williams 4:17

Yeah. And it's a great mission. It's so needed. We were talking earlier, before I started the recording that when my son was diagnosed almost 13 years ago, there was so little online and available for parents like me, and I just didn't know what to do. Like, I really wanted to help this kid. And there was lots of articles on ADHD and kind of that symptomology and the diagnostic symptoms that we see, but there wasn't anything on like, what do I do as a parent? What can I do to really be helpful to him. And so it's amazing that there's so many out there and I love what you guys are doing and I love that there's multiple perspectives in what you're doing because I think that's really valuable to help parents You know, different parents, because we're also different. And so there's more relatability when you have different voices together in your courses, so it's really exciting. Absolutely exciting work. Thank you. So let's talk about how do we find joy in this parenting because it's really challenging. And it can be really stressful. So like, where do we even start with that? What can we do? I certainly have a lot of ideas and things that I've done over the years. But I want to hear what your advice is. For parents,

The Childhood Collective 5:31

I think a lot of it starts with a mindset shift. By the time a family is walking through our door for an evaluation, they've been getting a lot of feedback and criticism about their parenting and about their child, the school is telling them that their child is not behaving well. They're getting daily calls from the principal, all over their families providing lots of parenting advice, telling them that they need to discipline more, that they're not parenting well, that they need to cut out screens, they need to cut out sugar. So by the time parents are walking through the door for, a diagnostic evaluation, they're feeling pretty defeated. And I think a big piece of helping parents find joy, and raising kids with ADHD is making that mindset shift. I mean, there's just so many, right that it's not caused by bad parenting that these kids really are desperate to do. Well, these kids are good, they have good hearts, they don't want to be naughty. They don't want to be getting in trouble at school, a huge piece of it is just helping parents kind of undo years of criticism and feedback that they've been getting to help them see their child in a different light. Yeah, that their kid really wants to do well. So important.

Yeah, I had a family come in recently. And we talk about, questions when we start testing for ADHD. And and one of their questions really was, is it It can't do or is it a won't do? And I feel like that's such an important question for so many parents, and not a lot of parents will vocalize that, but that's really what they're thinking is making that shift from, they won't do it, they won't do these things, too, they can't do these things, they don't have the skills to do these things. And shifting that perspective. Yeah, we

talk a lot about in our blog, and in our Instagram, defiance. And when you really get beneath the surface of defiance that there's a lot of times something else going on whether that's like they're having a huge meltdown for math, because math is actually really difficult for them, or they don't really have the executive functioning capacity to do this multiple step thing that we feel is really pretty simple. And so it's amazing when parents really reframe that defiance into, like, what are the skills that are maybe missing? How can I support my child, because when you have a kiddo, and I have a daughter, who sometimes can get really defiant. And it's like, oh, my goodness, like, it really damages that relationship with your child, like you're fighting for them in the schools and everywhere else advocating with family, but then they're fighting against you, in some ways, too. And it's like, oh, my gosh, this is really, this can be so overwhelming. So when you kind of reframe it, it's like, Okay, what is challenging about this? And how can I support it? That's a huge mindset shift for a lot of parents.

Penny Williams 8:18

Yeah, my mantra is, your child isn't giving you a hard time your child is having a hard time. And when you really focus on that, it's so much easier to stay calm, it's so much easier to think about what is going on for them, what is causing the behavior that we're seeing on the surface. Because what we see on the surface is not really what's going on, it's not the problem. We feel like it is because you know, we're getting the brunt of it. But the problem is really something underneath that. And I love that you've brought that up, because that was one of the most valuable pieces of advice I got. And not early on enough, unfortunately. But that was my first big aha and sort of mindset shift was behaviors, communication, and I need to be digging deeper, I need to be figuring out why because kids really do want to do well, these kids all have greatness within them. And it's our job to really help them find that right. And for me, a big piece of that sort of mindset shift was work on myself, and accepting that some things are a struggle, and some things I cannot change. But how do I still make a life that has joy and success and feeling confident for my kid, even though he has some extra struggle within that and not fighting against that struggle? Sort of a lot of acceptance had to happen for me and I think for a lot of parents.

The Childhood Collective 9:43

Yeah, I remember I was observing in a classroom once and the teacher had, mantras on the wall and things and one of the things was expectations are the root of all heartache. And I hate that and that is so true in so many areas of life but especially in, in parenting kids with ADHD. In our course, we start out by really educating parents on ADHD and the 1/3 rule that our kids development is not going to be at the same, their behavior on social and emotional development isn't going to be at the same rate is their peers, it's going to be 1/3 less than where their peers are at. So starting even with shifting the expectations, because if I expect my child to act like a 10 year old, I'm going to be constantly disappointed and frustrated and overwhelmed. So even starting with just understanding what ADHD is, and shifting my expectations around that, like you said, is so helpful.

Penny Williams 10:42

Yeah, guys want to add anything to that.

The Childhood Collective 10:45

I think that's spot on just having those developmentally appropriate expectations is a huge shift that helps you grow your relationship with your child, because your interactions from that point on are going to be a lot more positive, because you're not putting expectations on them that are just completely unrealistic. So when you meet them where they are, that's when you can see them grow. And that makes me think of another thing that I think can help parents find joy in parenting, and we talk about this a lot is that all of our kids need something that they do well, it's very hard as a parent, when you see your child struggling, and when they spend their day struggling at school, and then they come home, and your relationship is challenging, because you're bearing the brunt of the school breakdown. It's hard to see your child struggle. So one thing that's really important for kids, but also really helps parents is finding that thing that your child really does well, where do they shine? What do they love? Because when you see your child happy and successful, that feels good for you, too, right? Yeah,

Penny Williams 11:47

yeah, that's so important. And I think that we talk a lot about how much the kids need that. But I really hadn't even thought about how much we need that as parents to, we need to see them succeed, because we will feel better about what's going on with them. And, something that you said to you brought up the fact that if we continue to resist, if we continue to fight against kind of what our reality is, or fight against our kids, right, we're at fight against changing our expectations, a lot of parents really struggle with that, then it's going to continue to be hard, we're going to continue to have those battles. And that's a really important piece of it is really adjusting those expectations, they have to be different for your child than what you would give to a neurotypical kid. And that's super valuable in so many ways. And I think that probably really comes in with executive functioning challenges. Do you want to talk about that? cainy? Sure. So,

The Childhood Collective 12:47

you know, kids with ADHD definitely have differences in their executive functioning skills. And really, this is happening in their brain. So this is not like necessarily like a willful behavior. And so what we often see is, like, to Lori's point, she said, do they know how to do it, or they won't do it. And what I see in practice to is kids do know how to do it in some senses, but they can't put all the pieces together to sequence all those things, and each part feels almost insurmountable. And so really helping parents think through, like, I'm thinking of a task, like cleaning up your bedroom, or packing your bag for school. Those are two that I hear a lot. In my house, the morning routines have been tricky. I've had a respite from that with summer break, and I've loved it. But we're obviously getting back to the school year. And it's like, it's really hard to do that whole morning routine. And this can be challenging, all kids are developing their executive functioning. So this is something that all parents can actually work on.

But recognizing that it is a specific area of need for kids with ADHD, and that's really like, visualizing what is it gonna look like when I'm finished? You know what talking through and drawing and showing like, what does a clean bedroom look like? What does it look like when you're completely ready for school, and then helping to break down some of those steps. Something that I've more recently come to really appreciate is really including kids in that process. I think I came from a background where I worked in a classroom for kids with autism, and it was very adult directed, like we made a schedule, and it was on the board and the kids would go and pick off the picture and like stick it in the envelope, and then we would do that task. And I think there's value in that, especially for younger kids. I see it a lot in just early preschool.

But as kids get older and do more that school age, having them help you Hey, it seems like we keep forgetting our lunch. Like what can we do about that? How can we solve that? And it sort of shifts you out of the role of like, I'm the fixer of this problem that you're having and much more into a collaboration like we're gonna work together to figure this out. And again, I was talking about my daughter who's really really bright has a lot of opinions. I think she loves the app like, she would much rather me say, hey, do you think we could find a basket to put all your school stuff in so that it's like ready by the door, I'm thinking of the backpack, the lunch, the books, whatever needs to go with us. She's also a runner. So she has like her running shoes, and then her regular shoes. And I love that she's so confident and running, but I don't want to drive home and get her her white uniform shoes after running club everyday. Like, that doesn't work for me. So we have to kind of figure this out. But she would much rather be a part of that problem solving. And for me, personally, that helps me find joy in the situation, it's less like, I'm the supervisor, and much more like we're a team here. And that goes back to that confidence piece to like, they're going to need to problem solve this throughout their life. We all use planners alarms scheduled. So we have tools that we use to keep our executive functioning going. And so helping them build that early. I personally, I have seen in my own practice, and also just as a parent, that's just so important to bring them into those conversations.

Penny Williams 16:02

And you're offering ownership by doing that. And kids always, when we get their buy in, things definitely go a little easier. And I think to supporting executive functioning, really understanding how much it's impacting our kids and giving them tools and strategies can reduce a lot of stress, especially like those mornings when we're trying to get them ready. And they're always off task. And we're so stressed out, we have to get them to school at a certain time. We have to be at work at a certain time. You know, when we have systems and tools in place that work that is helping us to find joy in our parenting, right, that's reducing some of that stress that that really also helps them feel good and helps them succeed, too.

The Childhood Collective 16:44

Yeah, I've had an interesting dynamic the last few months too, because my husband and I have been really intentional about laughing when it doesn't go well, because we have systems everywhere. I'm a systems person. And then the and sometimes it works really well. And then there's days where I'm like, why is your sock in the snake plant like what is happening. And and we've kind of actually made a point of laughing about it, which previously, I feel like I would have been a great my teeth and been like, this is so hard and you get really frustrated. But the outcomes more or less the same regardless. So that's another thought too is like finding, whether it's your partner or someone you can call afterwards and be like, Oh my gosh, like to your friend or your mom, like this crazy thing happened, you won't believe I had everything set and then coffee got spilled over all the lunches, or whatever it is, and almost kind of reframing it for yourself. Because that's something that I always perceived mornings as like, I just have to grind through it, and eventually come out like white knuckles on the other side, but I'll get through it. And that's worked. But it hasn't been fun. Right has not been joy. So finding that humor and just being like, This is absurd. This is literally absurd. What's happening right now. And kind of just letting yourself laugh and be like, well, that's it's crazy town. So that's another thought with those routines. Because I feel like systems are a double edged sword, like parents are like, Yes, we'll use a system. And then sometimes they're like, it didn't work. So like, and we can learn from it. But it's Yeah, that can be frustrating.

Penny Williams 18:13

I love that you brought laughter into it. Because it's really so important. I had psychologists speak at the happy mama retreat one year, several years ago when she talked about talking to the peas. And when things are just crazy, and everybody's intense, you open the freezer, and you start talking to the frozen peas like they're a person and that breaks the tension. And you can't help but feel different when someone starts talking to the peas in the freezer. And I just I always think about that, because that's so good. Like that really will make such a difference for a lot of kids and parents, right. And it's being able to have enough awareness and mindfulness when you're in the thick of it to stop and say, okay, we need some levity here, we need something else, we've got to stop on this track that we're on, right, because it's only going to get more intense and more difficult. So what other strategies? Yeah, we've talked about a few now. And and there's some really great stuff there anything else that really comes to mind? Anything else that you're teaching parents to do to really kind of make some more room for joy?

The Childhood Collective 19:22

Yeah. So Katie's point about bringing humor into it. That's kind of like the, in the moment, things are crazy. How can I get some humor to make it through this moment? I think bigger picture. We talk a lot about trading correction for connection. And this leads to more joy for everyone. And what we mean by that is, especially when you're raising kids with challenging behavior, it's really easy as a parent to get stuck in a cycle of correction after correction. Noticing when things aren't going well. barking commands at your child one after another just to get out the door in the morning to take Katie's example. You And over time, when kids are getting this negative feedback so much more frequently on their behavior than any kind of connection or positive feedback, that's going to wear on their self esteem, it's going to wear on the parent child relationship. And it's going to be really hard to find joy in parenting. So thinking and taking really concrete steps towards How can I trade these corrections for more connection is really important. So some ways we do that is just trying to pay more attention to when your child is getting it right, your child's doing a great job, some of those things that maybe we take for granted, your kid puts their dishes in the sink independently, something that you would normally just ignore, today, you like, take the second to acknowledge how much you really appreciate that they brought their dish to the sink. But then also, a little bit more of a time investment, but on a daily basis, setting aside five to 10 minutes to just really play and connect with your child proactively not in response to anything else. But every day, we set aside this time to connect. And it's really child directed. And I'm not going to tell my child what to do at all, it's just for us to really connect. So really thinking about how for a lot of us are spending a lot of our time correcting, how can I take that same time investment, and put that in connecting and how much more joy can that bring us

Penny Williams 21:18

tons connection is so so important. And now more than ever, because we've been pretty isolated for a long time trying to come out of the pandemic anyway. And so, connection helps our kids feel safe, it helps any human being feel safe, the more connected we are, the safer we feel, the calmer our nervous system is, and it's so incredibly valuable. And we often I think aren't intentional enough about our relationship with our kids, because we get caught up in getting out the door because we get caught up in trying to get sleep, and get our kids to bed. And we get caught up in homework. And the battles that go with that and calls from school. And you know, there's so much just with our kids outside of the rest of our lives, our work life or you know, whatever else we're doing with our day, and really like scheduling time, put it on your calendar, schedule five minutes just to really connect with your kid, even if you know, they're talking about something that you just could snooze and snore over like you just, you have to be open and excited about what excites them. Because then that fosters that communication. Whereas if we're saying, I, you've told me about this 1000 times I don't want to hear about Minecraft anymore, is not helpful, right? It feels like an overwhelming need on our part sometimes. But that connection is just so, so important. As human beings really, yep.

The Childhood Collective 22:51

Yeah, it is. And I feel like, parenting kids with ADHD. And what we really recommend, and what we see is really effective for kids isn't natural for us, as parents, what is natural for us as parents is things kind of go along and when something doesn't go, how it should be or how we think it should be we kind of correct or we try and figure it out and problem solve and manage that behavior in the moment. And for parents of kids with ADHD, they're getting constant, like Mallory said, constant feedback from their family or friends or other people or school professional saying you need to discipline them more, you need to punish them more, you need to be correcting them more. And we're kind of saying that's really not where you start, and a lot of parents are coming to us saying, What do I do when this behavior happens? What do I do when they're defiant? What do I do when they're hitting? What do I do when they're yelling? And we kind of want people to take a step back and say, the real question we should be asking is what do we do to prevent this behavior from happening in the first place, and setting up systems, like you said, of really being intentional about teaching those expectations that we want teaching those missing skills, and providing a lot of praise and a lot of reinforcement. And that's really what is going to provide long lasting change in behaviors. And not just that, that's where we find more joy. Because when we as parents are noticing all of the great things that they're doing. I mean, our perspective changes, we're noticing the good things in our life. So a lot of times people are like hesitant to do reward systems or reinforcement systems. And those systems are really a lot more in place for us as parents to teach us to be noticing those things. Just as much as it is for kids, for us to kind of assist them to change the way we you know, interact with our kids.

Penny Williams 24:50

Yeah, it's really 99% us and like 1% our kids, we're not talking about changing our kids. We're talking about helping them be the best version of them, that they can be, helping them to navigate a neurotypical world with a neurodivergent brain. And there's so much joy that we had in that. And it often gets lost because of all of the struggle, especially starting out when your kid is first diagnosed, and you're trying to take in all this information. And, so many people are coming at you with different struggles and different needs and expectations, it can be really hard just to stand back and say, all their expectations don't matter so much. It's what my kid can do now, where they are and who they are right now. And helping them to feel successful, just as you all were saying early on, their successes can be our successes, too, they can also bring us a lot of joy. That's really what we're looking for, when we're struggling so much with the squat, when we're struggling so much with homework, and, we're trying to help our kids succeed. But it's, it's coming out in a way that can be really tough to live with, for all of us, right?

The Childhood Collective 26:08

You know, there's something that really stuck with me. A few weeks ago, we pulled our audience and we asked them to share with us if there was a particular mindset shift that had helped them in parenting their child with ADHD. And so I can't take credit for this. This is one of the responses that we got to this poll, this parent said, in the challenging moments, I remind myself, I'm missing the beauty of the storm. I'm missing the beauty of the storm. So it is a lot about, again, coming back to noticing your child's unique strengths and the many gifts that they bring to the table, not getting caught up in all of the other things that are very easy to get caught up in and really try to see the beauty of it.

Penny Williams 26:53

Yeah, yeah, taking that step back. And being very purposeful and intentional, which can be really hard. You know, it's easy for us to talk about this stuff. And it's gotten really easy for me, because I've been practicing for 13 years. So when newer parents Listen, or parents are still struggling, listen, I know that it takes a lot of mindfulness, it takes a lot of work, consistent daily work, to be able to be more purposeful, to be able to be more aware, to be able to stay calm, when there is a storm, and to be able to say that not everything matters. Some things just aren't that important. And we need to let go of them. And we need to honor who our kid is and where they are right now. And that takes a lot of work. You know, and so we're not talking about sort of flipping a switch, you listen to this. And now you're able to just do all those great things. It's it's much more difficult than that.

The Childhood Collective 27:44

No, and I'm honestly in in it right now. I mean, I feel like we talk about this all the time. But we just got back from vacation, and my daughter was so defiant. And I realized after a week of it, we were getting into this really negative corrective cycle. And at least you know, I know what's happening. And I can take a step back, and I can say, Okay, this is what I need to do. And we really shifted things to being very intentional about teaching things and giving her a lot of positive feedback and giving her a lot of extra time, like just connecting. And manna has made such a difference in like, a few days, like a totally different child, when I make that shift in how I am with her. But it took her saying to me, Mom, you're grumpy a lot. corrective feedback for you, I guess. Yeah, it was corrective feedback for me. And so you know, we all struggle with this, like, I know what to do, and I still don't do it. And, again, we're all in this, it comes from somebody who's doing this on a daily basis, and I still can't do it consistently. But we at least have tools to kind of know what to do when those moments happen. And we see that kind of cycle happening.

Penny Williams 28:59

Yeah,

The Childhood Collective 29:00

and I was just gonna say to on that same note is you were kind of mentioning to Penny like letting go of that guilt that we have so often, like, I'm not doing it perfect, or I know that I'm trying but some days, I feel like I just totally messed it up. And now it's like, we can't even do it. And I think that there was a post and I'm not going to quote the statistic, I wish I would have pulled it up. But I think it was something about emotion coaching. Maybe one of you guys knows that if you're doing emotion coaching, like 20% of opportunities, you're going to see growth or something like that. So thinking about like, if you even get one in five, you're making progress to that mindset shift into encouraging your child, I think in the parenting world, and we're pretty deep in it. As I know you are too. It feels like there's so many things to think about. Like I need to like make sure my child eats vegetables did not hide the vegetables because they have to know they're eating vegetables because that's an important part of being a flexible eater and I have to have a flexible bedtime routine but like my child needs 11 hours of sleep and there's so many things In parenting that are just coming at you. And I think that's a blessing and a curse of our generation. But really, I want to speak to any parents, especially parents that are new to this diagnosis or these challenges, like, they're just figuring it out, and you're like, Okay, tomorrow's a new day, and I'm gonna do it perfect. That's probably not going to happen. And that's okay. Like, you're still making a difference. I think, apologizing to our kids, letting them see us grow as people making it clear that we all struggle, like there's things that are hard for me, there's things that are hard for your brother, there's things that are hard, even we bring like grandparents into it. Well, grandma's really working on this. And I think that's just normalizing their experience of I'm improving, or I'm supposed to work on this attention thing or whatever. I just want to say that as far as like, parenting guilt, I'm right there with you. But I think the reframe there is just like, do what you can do when you can do it and realize that like, we're all human, and that's just part of this process.

Penny Williams 30:57

Yeah, give yourself some grace, be kind to yourself, it's hard, we get so caught up again, I know I've said that, like 20 times in this episode, it's so easy to just fall into what's happening and to fall into patterns. And it takes a lot of awareness. But also, to your point, it's really important not to try to do everything at one time. We're diluting our efforts for one thing, so we're not going to be as successful with any of it. But also like, we can't handle it, our kids can't handle it. It's too much pressure, too much stress. Figure out what's most important and work on one or two things at a time. And you'll have more successes. That way, your child will have more successes that way, and you'll be able to breathe. Like we all just need time to breathe, too. Yeah. So for everyone listening, you can find a link to the childhood collective. And we'll link up the course as well at parenting ADHDandautism.com/138 for Episode 138. And I definitely encourage you to reach out and look at their website, look at the cars following social media. There's always lots of tips and tricks and good stuff there too. And really take advantage of these ladies work and what they're putting out in the world to help our kids with ADHD and help us as their parents. Thank you all so much for finding time that all three of you could get together and have this great conversation. I know it's going to help so many parents. Thank you pat, thank you so much for having me. Thank you so much. With that we'll end the episode now and I'll see everyone next time. Thanks for joining me on the parenting ADHD podcast. If you enjoyed this episode, please subscribe and share. And don't forget to check out my online courses, parent coaching and Mama retreats at parentingADHDandautism.com

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