Kurtis Lee Thomas [00:00:01]: The body is a living library for all of our stresses, traumas, heartbreaks, failures. That's why they say the issues are in the tissues. And what happens is our diaphragms get stressed and tense where we can no longer breathe down deep into our bellies. And on a subconscious level, where the human body holds the most emotion is actually in the belly and around the hips.

Penny Williams [00:00:26]: Welcome to Beautifully Complex, where we unpack what it really means to parent neurodivergent kids with dignity and clarity. I'm Penny Williams and I know firsthand how tough and transformative this journey can be. Let's dive in and discover how to raise regulated, resilient, beautifully complex kids together. Oh, and if you want more support, join our free community at Hub beautifullycomplex.

Penny Williams [00:00:56]: Hi, everyone. Welcome back to Beautifully Complex. Today I have with me Curtis Lee Thomas, who transforms lives through breath work. So we're going to talk all about using breath work both for parents and for kids to help with regulation. And I think we'll talk about how it helps with other things as well. But will you start by letting everybody know who you are and what you do?

Kurtis Lee Thomas [00:01:22]: All right, well, first of all, thank you for having me.

Penny Williams [00:01:24]: Thank you.

Kurtis Lee Thomas [00:01:25]: And my name is Curtis Lee Thomas, and yeah, I'm a breathwork facilitator and trainer. So I not only facilitate my own events for many years, but I shifted about five years ago and started certifying other people in this modality so they can go out and teach it as well.

Penny Williams [00:01:40]: Awesome. Yeah. And you have a kids book out as well, right?

Kurtis Lee Thomas [00:01:44]: I do. Called the Secret of Life. Just Breathe.

Penny Williams [00:01:48]: Awesome. I'm sure we'll talk a little more about that as we jump into it. But I want to start with just defining breathwork for anybody who doesn't know what is breath work.

Kurtis Lee Thomas [00:01:58]: So it can get confusing because there's many different forms of breath work. If you think of yoga, right. There's many different forms of yoga. You have, you know, hot yoga, and then you have yin yoga, and then you have, you know, flow yoga. So breath work is the umbrella term and there's many different modalities that fall under that. And what I specialize in is deep diaphragmatic breathwork, which is called breathwork detox. So it's extremely somatic and cathartic. It's one of the most powerful healing, natural healing modalities on the planet.

Kurtis Lee Thomas [00:02:32]: But under that, I also teach different breathing techniques, but they're more for maintenance. And I look at the deep diaphragmatic breathwork as like the deep Cleaning. And then after you get that, you know, deep cleaning in your house, then you can have maintenance, and it's a lot easier to maintain.

Penny Williams [00:02:48]: Yeah. And it is a lifelong practice. Right. It's not something where we do it. Maybe we have some healing and then we're done.

Kurtis Lee Thomas [00:02:55]: Yeah, well, we're practicing every day. Everybody's breathing, and it's like the. It's the same. It's like, you know, practice makes perfect. Well, if you keep practicing the same thing wrong over and over again, you just get really good at doing the wrong thing. And the problem is many of us are breathing incorrectly. So if I'm, you know, I do a lot of large group events, and I always have in the very beginning, everyone take a deep breath with me. And I'll say, put your hand on your belly, put your hand in your chest.

Kurtis Lee Thomas [00:03:24]: Count of three, Everyone take the deepest breath ever. And then they go. And then I watch them, and they all breathe into their chest, their clavicles all up here. But really, we're meant to breathe down into our belly. And if you watch a dog or a baby watch a baby breathe, When a baby takes a breath in the belly moves. But how come us adults, our bellies don't move anymore? And that's because something got ahold of us called life. And in that life, there's a lot of stress. And the body is a living library for all of our stresses, traumas, heartbreaks, failures.

Kurtis Lee Thomas [00:04:00]: That's why they say the issues are in the tissues. And what happens is our diaphragms get stressed, intense, where we can no longer breathe down deep into our bellies. And on a subconscious level, where the human body holds the most emotion is actually in the belly and around the hips. So what we do is that sometimes we try to cut ourselves off from feeling, quote, unquote, the pains of life. Right? So we. We subconsciously don't breathe down there. But what we directly do is we also cut off our joys from life because 80% of our serotonin is produced in our gut, and that is the stuff that makes you happy. And then 80% of your immune system is in your gut, and that's the stuff that makes us healthy.

Kurtis Lee Thomas [00:04:46]: So 80% of our health and our happiness is in our gut. And we're not breathing the most vital life force energy known to man, breath and oxygen, into the place that needs it the most.

Penny Williams [00:04:57]: Wow. Yeah. And you talk about breath work as a form of emotional detox. And I think you just gave us the reason why, Right. If our emotions are housed in our belly and our hips and we're doing breath work in that area, then we're feeling emotions, we're processing emotions. Is that right?

Kurtis Lee Thomas [00:05:18]: Yes. And I think the most mind boggling thing about trying to explain what I do with people, and first of all, I tell people trying to describe breath work is like trying to describe a kaleidoscope to a blind person because it's virtually impossible to explain. It can only be experienced because, you know, breath work and breathing, it's very unassuming. You're like, how is breathing going to change my life? Like if I said, penny, hey, we're going to take this walk in the park and this walk is going to change your life. Like, how magical can that walk be, right? Yeah, it's just breathing. But what's so fascinating is I do these events for. It doesn't matter if I'm doing it for Nike, NASA, prison inmates, it doesn't matter. Statistically or let's say an average, about 60% of all the people in the room will break down in tears.

Kurtis Lee Thomas [00:06:11]: And it could be the most masculine men I'm working with, Navy Seals, NFL athletes, and that's because the body just holds on to so much. And what I've learned on my own personal healing journey is that it doesn't matter how many green juices you drink, right? Or, you know, how many miles you can run if you're holding on to the toxic emotions of guilt, shame, regret or anger, you know, it's a death wish. And that's what happens to the body, is it? It holds onto these things and it wreaks havoc within our nervous system. And then we become dysregulated and then we, you know, we think we need this pill and think we need that pill when really we're just holding on to so much stress and accumulated stress. And that can just be from being a single parent or being an entrepreneur and having to take care of employees before you, you know, whatever that may be. And we just need the proper tools. And I was just mind blown myself because I was already in this work for a decade as a certified life coach, hypnotherapist, NLP practitioner, Reiki master, and over a decade, I didn't know this breathing technique existed. And it wasn't until I had a stomach condition where doctors couldn't heal me, they couldn't diagnose me.

Kurtis Lee Thomas [00:07:23]: I was suffering for five years. And I did every test you can imagine. Colonoscopy, endoscopy. I didn't even know you can swallow a Frigging pill camera that's like this big. And I saw the camera, I'm like, oh, wow. Like, that's pretty cool. They couldn't find anything. And then I found this lost ancient breathing technique that's been recently resurfaced.

Kurtis Lee Thomas [00:07:43]: And I did one session, Penny. And it completely eradicated my stomach condition, where doctors couldn't even fix me, diagnose me. And I'm a very skeptical, logical, analytical person. You know, maybe it's the Capricorn to me. I don't know. Like, I gotta see it to believe it. And I couldn't wrap my head around how I did all these things in this one technique is what did it. But then it hit me.

Kurtis Lee Thomas [00:08:06]: I'm like, you know, what these doctors didn't know was wrong with me because my issue wasn't physical, right?

Penny Williams [00:08:12]: It was.

Kurtis Lee Thomas [00:08:12]: It was emotional, it was energetic, and they don't understand that. And I think the future of wellness is where east medicine meets Western medicine. Like, they have to come together because I'm not the woo woo person where I'm like, you know, you break my arm, you know, give me a painkiller, I got a cavity. Give me the Novocate, right? So I'm very much, you know, balanced in that. But there's a lot that we don't know and doctors don't know about emotional healing.

Penny Williams [00:08:40]: And emotion is everything. It's the core of the human experience. And it does dictate how we feel. What we're doing with our emotions dictates how we feel. And I think culturally we're taught to not share our emotions, to hold them in unless they're the, you know, and I'm giving air quotes here for people who are just listening. The positive emotions, right? And all emotions are natural. All emotions are just part of life. And I talk a lot about helping kids to recognize that, to facilitate that understanding for our kids so that they can process emotion so it doesn't eat them up when they're stuffing it down.

Penny Williams [00:09:20]: Right. How can breathwork sort of bridge the gap between this emotional dysregulation? Maybe we're holding it in or our kids don't know how to process it in ways that are healthy yet and kind of self awareness for them. Because so many neurodivergent kids really struggle with self awareness. And so I imagine that breath work can really help sort of tie that together and build more awareness. Would you agree with that?

Kurtis Lee Thomas [00:09:48]: Yeah, you actually nailed it. I was gonna say that when you were talking is, you know, most adults don't have the tools and know what to do when they're dysregulated. So we can't expect the children to. So the main thing is self awareness. Right? And that is parent checking in with the kid. You know, hey, how are you feeling right now? We're doing cool and fun exercises. You know, where do you feel heavy in your body right now? Where do you feel happy in your body right now? And it gets them to get out of their mind, which is where we all live, and into their body, you know, which is a really good exercise because, you know, the mind is, it's a bad neighborhood, we don't want to live there. So drive by, lock the doors.

Kurtis Lee Thomas [00:10:28]: You know, a lot of crazy things go on there. But when we get into our body and really get in tune and see how we feel, that's the first step and is putting awareness and consciousness and wow, how do I feel? How am I breathing right now? You know, where do I feel heaviness in my body? And after you have that awareness? Well, you just need a couple tools. And breath work is the best because, you know, the breath has vital life force energy that awakens the cells in the body, it revitalize them and the cells have memory. And the breath is a very interesting thing because it's the only system in the body that we can control, but then also works on its own. And you know, we never get the instruction manual to the breath. And the most, you know, amazing organic inner technology, you know, that we have. And there's monks in the Himalayas that will go in, you know, frigid sub below temperatures and get wet sheets, put them on their body and then using a special breath technique, they'll heat up the sheets so they start steaming. So it's like, you know, that's another level, don't get me wrong.

Kurtis Lee Thomas [00:11:39]: But it shows like what the breath can, can do. And it'll take you out of a panic attack faster than any pill you can swallow. Because if you're swallowing the pill, and this is coming from experience, I was on Lexapro and Ativan and you know, I was riddled with anxiety. And when you take a pill you swallow, it has to go into your stomach and then it has to break down and then go through your small intestine. It's like, you know, it could be 20 minutes, but you can do a short breathing technique and in two minutes completely regulate your system. So I think breathwork doesn't get the credit that it does is because it's too simple. Yeah, it's too Simple. And it's literally been right under our noses the entire time.

Kurtis Lee Thomas [00:12:21]: Yeah, I like the little joke, because if you go, it's literally right under the nose.

Penny Williams [00:12:27]: It's a good trick for kids, though, like young kids, to teach them to do it. I love that. What other sort of tips do you have or strategies do you have to simplify breathwork or to engage kids in breathwork? I think, you know, we don't want to add to our daily lives. We're already overwhelmed. It's chaotic. How do we build this into everyday life so that we can help our kids regulate? Like, breathwork is the ultimate regulation strategy, I think, and so we can use it anywhere. Right, but how do we. How do we help our kids engage?

Kurtis Lee Thomas [00:13:15]: Well, we help our kids engage by us engaging, making it a part of our life, the parents life. And I wrote three books. I'm working on my fourth right now. And then I coach some people who are working on their books and I tell them, listen, writing a book isn't hard. Sitting down to write the book is hard. That means making the decision that I'm gonna do this at this time and I'm gonna implement this in my life. And it's just making that commitment. Now.

Kurtis Lee Thomas [00:13:44]: The good thing about the breath is that you only need two minutes. Two minutes here, two minutes there. Even if you did just two minutes a day, you know, that's enough to affect your nervous system. So one, I wouldn't go out and try to learn all the breathing techniques because if you try to learn them all, then you end up doing none of them. So for sure you want to use a technique. So the easiest one is box breathing, which is you, you know, breathe in through your nose for four seconds, and then you pause for four seconds, and then you breathe out for four seconds, pause for four seconds, breathe in for four seconds. So you're literally doing this box breathing in four second intervals and at the top and the bottom of each breath, you're holding for four seconds. And what this does is it gets you into parasympathetic, which is your rest and digest.

Kurtis Lee Thomas [00:14:37]: And most people are stuck in their sympathetic nervous system, which is their fight or flight. And that's their default mode. So training the body to go back into parasympathetic where it's safe, because that's what the body thinks. It doesn't think it's safe. And then when you do that, what I also realize is that you actually become clearer and you have more creativity. Because if you think, you know, they give the analogy, if A saber tooth tiger came in the room right now. You wouldn't be thinking about your taxes or, you know, where are you going to get the grocery? It's like, oh, crap, you know, fight or flight. And what really happens is all your thoughts and all these, you know, different options that you have narrowed down, and now you're just, you know, looking down a tunnel of just one option or two options, fight or flight.

Kurtis Lee Thomas [00:15:23]: But what happens is when we're stressed, might not be a tiger in the room, but it could just be all these other things. It might not narrow down to the tunnel vision or fight or flight, but it might be a little bit wider of a highway, but it limits your options in life and what you're able to see. So when you get into your parasympathetic, all of a sudden, a lot of your problems are solved because the answers were there in front of you the entire time. And this is the importance of how regulating your nervous system can literally change your life and your perspective. Because if you shift your perspective on your own life, everything changes. Because that's what we have. That's how we evolve over time. People say, you know, time is what makes us evolve.

Kurtis Lee Thomas [00:16:05]: Time does not make us evolve. If anything, time we grow old and we die over time.

Penny Williams [00:16:10]: For sure.

Kurtis Lee Thomas [00:16:11]: It's what happens over time. Yeah, and what happens over time is we elevate our awareness, we have more experiences, we have more wisdom. And what that does is it shifts our perspective on past events that already happened.

Penny Williams [00:16:21]: And.

Kurtis Lee Thomas [00:16:21]: And then that's how we evolve. So, you know, I just think if people are able to implement, you know, a simple one, box breathing is a really good one. They can look up 4, 7, 8 method is one Navy SEALs use to go to sleep at night, which is breathe in for four seconds, pause for seven seconds, and then breathe out for eight seconds. And then a very simple one that changed me was straw breathing. And you just breathe normal as if you have a straw in your mouth. And you actually can take a straw, cut it in half, stick it in your pocket, because it's really good. If you feel anxiety or panic attack and you breathe regular, you put it in your mouth and you breathe regularly. You don't try to suck the straw or push the air out.

Kurtis Lee Thomas [00:17:00]: You breathe regular. But what happens is it kind of regulates the shape of your mouth, allowing only a certain amount of CO2 and oxygen to come in, which is the perfect amount that calms the nervous system. So those would be the three. Now, if you want something that's going to be Life changing, something you're looking for a breakthrough. That's what I teach, which is breathwork detox. It's apples and oranges from those maintenance ones and breathwork detox. The reason why I went all in with this one is because we do live in a microwave society where people want to see results and they want to see results fast. And most of the time that's unattainable.

Kurtis Lee Thomas [00:17:37]: You're not going to go to the gym and have a six pack in the morning. It doesn't work like that. But unlike yoga and meditation, the results of breathwork detox are immediate and undeniable from one session. And that's why I had my huge breakthrough in that one session where I healed the stomach condition for five years. And I've led tens and thousands of people through this and I've witnessed miracles happen with this technique, which is the whole reason why I went full time. And I was like, I have to bring this to the world. Especially when I realized that 20 year old yogis who've been practicing, you know, for two decades had no idea this technique existed. So, you know, that's the deep cleaning and the other ones are the maintenance.

Kurtis Lee Thomas [00:18:19]: But definitely adopt. And I'll also say this too because I like to gamify it and make it fun. And this is for adults, kids, but you do a little game and say, okay, whenever we walk through a doorway or whenever we touch a doorknob, right, we're gonna pause and take a breath before every doorway we walk in. So now it kind of makes it fun. Oh, there's a doorway. Let's take a breath, right? And you can make it really kind of engaging. And the easiest one I can give you guys, here's one. Like if you're going to use just one of them, it's the most overlooked breathing technique and it's called the sigh.

Kurtis Lee Thomas [00:18:55]: And the reason why is if you look at the body's natural response, right? When the body has pent up energy, pent up stress, pain, tension, when it gets pent up to the max, the body does this, it does a sigh of relief, right? So that big build up and that exhale is the body's pressure release valve, releasing accumulated stress and tension. So breathwork detoxes, we induce that and we do that technique for a certain specific amount of time and it gives these huge, massive release. People feel euphoria, joy, lighter, more buoyant. And I suggest just to do the simple sigh walking through the doorways, right? Or every time you touch a doorknob, or every time you get in and out of your car, like, whatever it is, just choose that and stick to it. And if you just did three sighs right now, don't do it if you're driving, but just three size right now and make them, like, loud and obnoxious, right? So you want to go and then breathe just three in a row. You're gonna be like, oh, my God. I actually feel more calmer. I feel more relaxed.

Kurtis Lee Thomas [00:20:06]: But we don't do intentional size, right? The body just does it on its own. So just implementing that simple little technique, you're gonna be like, oh, my God, this stuff really works. And then that's what makes you become a believer and want to implement it more and more and more.

Penny Williams [00:20:22]: Yeah. I learned several years ago from a therapist out in the Midwest, too. When your kid is in meltdown, they're intense or having a hard time. The first thing that you should do before responding, before reacting is just take a really deep, empathetic breath. And I always caution parents, like, don't sound exasperated, but it can be contagious, Right. It can cause our kids to actually take that breath, too. But it just regulates us to be able to be intentional with what we do next and what we say next. And so it kind of goes along with that with, you know, this big sigh.

Penny Williams [00:21:01]: But just, again, parents, be careful that you're not sounding exasperated, because that will escalate your situation 100% every time.

Kurtis Lee Thomas [00:21:11]: It's true. It's funny because I'll do that, right? But I'll be out, and I'll just do these big, loud, obnoxious sighs. And then a couple times, this happened to me. People look over. Are you okay? Yeah. I'm like, what are you talking about? And I'm like, oh. They think because it's the body's natural way of releasing stress and tension. So when you hear somebody do that big sigh, it's like, oh, they're going through something, but they don't know that I'm intentionally doing it.

Kurtis Lee Thomas [00:21:34]: So I think that's kind of funny.

Penny Williams [00:21:35]: Yeah, we're all going to walk around that way now.

Kurtis Lee Thomas [00:21:38]: Yeah.

Penny Williams [00:21:39]: Yeah. Can we talk a little bit more about getting past the skepticism? Because, you know, I was one of these people. I had a very victim mindset for most of my life. And somewhere around 40, I said, Enough. I can't live like this anymore. And I tried to figure out, you know, what can I do? And it started with changing my thinking, right? But for so long, when somebody said, your thinking controls everything, I went, that's so hippie. That's so, like, not me. Right.

Penny Williams [00:22:10]: And then I found that it was really true, and I was very upset that I didn't believe it all those years and I wasn't leaning into what I know now and the nervous system and all these things. So for the skeptics out there, maybe there's a small step that they can start with to start to move in this direction.

Kurtis Lee Thomas [00:22:31]: Yeah. Well, I would dare never to try to have someone control their thoughts, although their thoughts do dictate their reality. But the problem with that is we have 50,000 thoughts per day, average human. And the crazy part is 80% of those thoughts are negative in nature and only 20% are positive. And 98% of the thoughts that we had today were the same thoughts we had yesterday. So a lot of people are stuck on that hamster wheel. So it's really hard to do that. But if you look at some of the self help gurus, or let's say one of the top in their game, I'd say would be Tony Robbins.

Kurtis Lee Thomas [00:23:08]: A lot of people know Tony Robbins. He's been doing this for 48 years. And he literally says, and I just saw him in Las Vegas, he said two things. One, if you're going to master anything, master the breath. That was one of his famous quotes. And then he said, if you want to change your life and how you think and how you feel, there's only one way to do it. He said, you need to change your state. So don't try to change your thoughts or your emotions, just change your state.

Kurtis Lee Thomas [00:23:34]: And the fastest and most effective way to change your state is by breathing. Right? Doing intentional breathing techniques. And that will change your state. And, and I love this one because, you know, Penny, I never wanted to do the work that I, that I do, like, get on stage and podcasts like, who the heck wants to public speak? Right? It's like one of the most feared things in the world.

Penny Williams [00:23:56]: Yeah.

Kurtis Lee Thomas [00:23:56]: And it's feared more than death, statistically. And I love the Jerry Seinfeld episode where he's like, people fear public speaking more than death. That means that they, they'd rather get up there and be in the casket than reading the eulogy.

Penny Williams [00:24:11]: Yes, exactly.

Kurtis Lee Thomas [00:24:13]: You know, but something I learned is that in Harvard, this study, that if you're really nervous, you're going to get on stage, you have a big promotion and you have a meeting or whatever, it may be a date. And you are nervous that if you try to take your nerves and relax and breathe and try to Calm yourself. It's actually not as effective as if you did this one thing. And that one thing is it's actually easier to trick yourself into believing that you're excited than to try to calm yourself. Because there's a very thin line between the fear and excitement. Because a lot of the things that you're probably afraid for is something you've been asking for all along, right? That meeting with that promotion, you know, the date with the hot guy or whatever it is. And it's easier to get ourselves excited than it is to calm ourselves down. So that's a state change as well.

Kurtis Lee Thomas [00:25:12]: Right. So just, you know, having these tools to change your state, I think is the quickest way to not just change your life, but to become a believer. Because you're talking about the skeptics. And I, one of the biggest skeptics, and I would say this, if you are skeptic about the ability of how such a simple thing as breathing can change your entire life, I would say try one session. And what that's going to do for you, it's going to make you a believer. And I've done this for the most resistant minds. I literally did this for the most left brain people in the world, which are rocket scientists at NASA. And they're very different personality than like when I work with people like Nike.

Kurtis Lee Thomas [00:25:57]: And I brought them through this and they were like this. We did a case study and everything they said, no prior event elicited the response that we got from this and the history of us doing mindfulness events and that. They put that on, you know, I think Bloomberg or something like that. And, you know, people who are very resistant, that's who I love working with. Because I don't need to work with you for three months. You don't need to buy packages from me. That's not how I work. You know, they come in, they do one session and they leave a believer because.

Kurtis Lee Thomas [00:26:24]: Not because I told them, it's because they experienced it for themselves. And I think that's why I always lead people to breathwork detox first, because it awakens you to the power of the breath. And now you're like, oh, wow, now I'm a believer. Now I know the breath works. What else is there? How else can I implement this into my life? So I like to work that way because I do believe a lot of people are skeptics. They do need to see it, to believe it. And, you know, it is what it is. And I get you because I'm the same exact way.

Penny Williams [00:26:52]: Yeah. Yeah. And it's a shift in that energy. I think about it as energy. What you're talking about is the state. And when we can shift our energy in that way, then we're more open. If we think about the science of it and the nervous system, if we're dysregulated, our thinking brain dims. It's not as accessible, if at all.

Penny Williams [00:27:13]: So when we experience being back in that regulated, connected zone, things become doable. And so we experience that, oh, my body feels a little lighter. I'm thinking more clearly. And then, yeah, you become a believer. And it can happen really quickly, that change, you know, just those three big sighs of relief. You will feel that in your body if you really lean into doing it.

Kurtis Lee Thomas [00:27:37]: Yeah, doing it is the hardest part, just choosing to do it. Okay, I'm going to do this now because it doesn't take a long time. 30 seconds, two minutes. It's nothing. It's just more the awareness and to pause. Just pause and say, I'm going to do this. I'm going to make this part of my life. Whether you got to put alarm on your phone, like, whatever you have to do, you know, it will be worth it.

Penny Williams [00:27:59]: Yeah. I always teach people to connect it with something. Do it every day before you get out of bed, do it every day before you have breakfast, or, you know, connect it with something you're already doing. And then you don't necessarily have to schedule or try to remember once you form that habit.

Kurtis Lee Thomas [00:28:15]: Yeah, that's good advice.

Penny Williams [00:28:16]: Will you tell everybody, Curtis, where they can find you online, where they can learn more about the Breathwork Detox and learn more from you?

Kurtis Lee Thomas [00:28:24]: Yeah. So if they're interested in Breathwork Detox, they can just go to breathwork detox.com and then they'll see a video there that educate them a little bit more. Program suite. If they wanted to do a virtual live event, which I facilitate every two weeks teacher training, so they can go there, they can find all that stuff if they want to connect with me directly. Instagram, man from the Stars. Just go type in man from the Stars on Instagram. And then I'm pretty decent with direct messages if people, you know, want to reach out to me. So, you know, as of now, I'm.

Kurtis Lee Thomas [00:28:56]: I'm. I'm doing pretty good.

Penny Williams [00:28:58]: Okay. Yeah. It's so hard to keep up with all the things. I will link all of that up in the show notes for everybody to make it super easy to access, as well as the different breathing techniques that you talked about and any other resources that we mentioned. Those are going to be in the show notes@parentingadhd and autism.com 323 for episode 323. Thank you so much for being here, sharing your energy, your passion for breath, work your strategies. I know it's going to change some lives for folks who are listening or watching.

Kurtis Lee Thomas [00:29:32]: Yes, I hope so. Thank you so much for having me. I appreciate it.

Penny Williams [00:29:35]: I'll see everybody next time. Take good care. I see you.

Penny Williams [00:29:41]: You're doing hard and meaningful work and you don't have to do it alone. If you found this episode helpful, share it with someone who needs it and leave a quick review so others can find this support too. When you're ready for next steps, the Regulated Kids Project is here with the tools, coaching and community to help you raise a more regulated, resilient child child. Get more info at regulatedkids.

Penny Williams [00:30:07]: Com.